Saturday, August 22, 2020

Marvel News & Notes

The Falcon and the Winter Soldier - Wikipedia

Christopher Marc (of HN Entertainment, but writing for The Ronin, which I've never heard of) speculates Falcon and the Winter Soldier's release will be delayed until 2021. His reasoning is interesting, since rather than the mechanics--when the show will shoot in the Czech Republic (October) and the necessary post-production of those re-shoots (along with WandaVision's expected release)--he suggests that Disney won't want it competing with The Mandalorian (the idea would be to spread out subscription hype and avoid competing for an audience). I'm not convinced by the argument, specifically in the case of the MCU, where the shows are meant to lead-in or follow-up to particular IP (Falcon is tied to Black Widow). I think Feige can call his shot here, although the general idea (delay until 2021) is feasible depending on the interplay between the two Disney+ shows (as in, how they are meant to connect).

Here's Why You Need to Check Out 'America,' Marvel's Canceled Series

Murphy found an audition video for an actress trying (and failing) to land the America Chavez role and this confirmed two things: 1) As rumoured, she's appearing in Doctor Strange 2, 2) Daniel's recent casting sheet is an updated one from TI's in January (same link; the older casting sheet was certainly given to them by Daniel, cf). I'm unfamiliar with the character, so news about her does nothing for me (I'll have to see her in action). This goes for the majority of modern characters, most of whom seem like derivative imitations of older, iconic versions, and aimed at a YA audience. Hopefully in translating them to screen the MCU can give them the gravitas to avoid that narrow appeal. A note to add here: her young age means there's no way Marvel will address her sexuality in this appearance.

Fantastic Four Costume Logo (1960s) | Fantastic four logo, Comics ...Blade's history with Marvel – here's why it's been such a long ...

Murphy also came across something he believes hints at a forthcoming Fantastic Four and possibly Blade (or Spider-Woman) films:

Disney registered two companies: Solve Everything Productions and Grass-Fed Productions. … There was no evidence to confirm that either of these two production companies were for Marvel Studios projects. I contacted several sources and went down some well-beaten paths but was unable to find the type of confirmation I’m happy with.

He goes on to make a solid argument for a connection between 'Solve Everything' and Hickman's run on Fantastic Four, with a much more tenuous connection for 'Grass-Fed' and Blade. He followed this up with another post where he was able to confirm that 'Grass-Fed' was for Marvel Studios and, along with the Blade possibility, considered that it could be Spider-Woman (see below) if it's being co-produced with Disney (the rights of Jessica Drew are split between the two companies, cf, where the costume and spider-related powers are owned by Sony, while everything else is at Marvel). There have been other iterations of Spider-Woman that Sony could use without the MCU, so this arrangement only works if it's the Jessica Drew version. The situation is very complicated and I'll explore it fully below, but needless to say, Blade is a much simpler option.

Silver Surfer (1968) #11 | Comic Issues | Marvel

As part of the promotion for his new magazine/website, Sutton put out a scoop saying that Silver Surfer will begin his MCU iteration as a villain (not just for the Fantastic Four, but possibly for Thor). This is new information from him (although he also repeats what he's said before)--could it be true? Sure, but there's not enough meat to address it as is.

Galactus

Sutton says the build towards Galactus as a primary antagonist will be gradual, with him only becoming the focus in the third Fantastic Four film. As per the comics, Silver Surfer will be his initial Herald, but will betray him and be replaced by Johnny Storm's girlfriend Frankie Raye (who does so to save the planet). This is in the early phases of consideration at Marvel, with no script written or directors attached, just the basic story outlined. Galactus will then have a larger role in a Secret Wars event (in May Sutton focused on Doom for that event, but that doesn't exclude Galactus from it).

Way back in September Sutton had Galactus attached to Nova and an Annihilation story, which I asked him about, and he says that Secret Wars (and that story) occur after the above (he does, incidentally, give the same outline for Silver Surfer in the old scoop). In December he mentioned the Frankie Raye storyline (which echoed LotLB in August via their original source). Certainly a slow build to the character makes a lot of sense and allows a proper Surfer origin story.

This Midnight Sons Series Needs to Be a Real Thing

Sutton says the rumoured Midnight Sons will appear in Blade 2, with Johnny Blaze making a cameo in the first Blade. The roster for the group is: BladeGhost RiderJennifer KaleMan-ThingWerewolf by Night, and Glyph. This lineup represents a change from his original iteration in January (which was Blade, Ghost Rider, Man-Thing, Moon Knight, and Helstrom)--I think that lineup was Marvel Entertainment's original pitch after the Netflix cancellations and thus quite dated. In early May Sutton added Charlie Cox's Daredevil to the roster, and a few weeks later removed Moon Knight (saying Feige wanted him for the Avengers instead). So 50% of the roster remains the same and it's gone from 100% male to a 4-2 split, which is far more plausible. Do I think an IP like this is coming from the MCU? It's plausible--it gives Blade somewhere to go--and this cast of B-list characters fits thematically.

A few tracking notes: Kale has only come up once before (in September from LotLB's original source); Glyph was part of Jeph Loeb's original plans (cf), with LotLB Tweeting out in January (same link) that she was going to be spun off Helstrom (without saying which source that came from); then in March LotLB said she was going to appear in Moon Knight (an idea that may still be current).

Avengers: Endgame () Avengers logo ., Avengers logo transparent ...

Sutton says this will be the Avengers lineup for their fifth film (splitting them between grounded and cosmic, but later in the scoop adding a possible West Coast Avengers, separating out the New Avengers as a separate thing, and never going into the cosmic lineup, although he offered some semblance of one back in May):

  • Grounded: Spider-ManMoon KnightLuke Cage, and Daredevil; also possibly Black KnightIron Heart, and Nova
  • West Coast: VisionWandaWar MachineAnt-Man

This feels disjointed (wouldn't Nova be on the unnamed cosmic roster?). Sutton does say this is still being discussed and is planned to evolve and change over time. There's a bit of confusion on Luke Cage because Sutton said he'd be part of New Avengers, but I think he meant the new iteration of the Avengers (as that makes a lot more sense), rather than the YA team that name is associated with. I always thought (conceptually) the West Coast Avengers was a weird idea and if that's being discussed I don't think it will go anywhere. We also have a broader issue--two of the actors included here (Don Cheadle and Paul Rudd) are getting very old for the superhero game (turning 56 and currently 51), so I'm particularly dubious that Cheadle will be around for the next Avengers.

JAN200799 - STRANGE ACADEMY #1 RAMOS VAR - Previews World

Sutton says Marvel has interest in developing Strange Academy (in film or animation, which is an odd dichotomy). He says it would be like a Marvel Hogwarts featuring magic characters--the kind of thing which can only be awful or entertaining (but sounds like something appealing to a young audience).

Ms. Marvel Disney+ Show Logo Revealed

Disney Insider writer Skyler Shuler (another former That Hashtag Show writer who also wrote for HN Entertainment) included a throwaway comment in an article that Captain Marvel directors Fleck and Boden will 'probably' direct the Ms. Marvel show. I hadn't heard that anywhere else and wonder where that's sourced (no one has come out to either support or deny it). Both directors are available (neither has done anything since the Mrs. America mini-series), for whatever that's worth.


Charles Villanueva neatly copy/pastes (not literally) most of my points about the problem with the Netflix characters appearing in the MCU, but pulls back at other ME IP because he can't give up on Quake. Look at these two comments:

Kevin Feige likely has his own idea of K’un L’un and Shou Lao, his own take on Frank Miller‘s iconic Hand/Bullseye/Elektra saga, his own version of Luke Cage that is primed for the Avengers [what this assertion is based on I have no idea, but it agrees with Sutton above], and his own vision of how he wants these characters to be. It’s hard to imagine any interest from Kevin Feige in continuing and tieing [tying] into stories that he had no hand in shaping.

Now that Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has ended and in light of rumors of a S.W.O.R.D. Disney+ show happening [Sutton, LotLB, GWW, Reddit, 4chan, cf], Chloe Bennet reprising her role as Quake is certainly a possibility 

I've mentioned many times before that I have no idea why it's so difficult for superfans to give up on the Quake dream--the arguments for the Netflix characters apply--why on earth would Feige want to complicate his life with a character from a show barely anyone watched (see the graph above) and whose entire story is something he outright rejects? To reboot the character with the same actress only causes headaches (yes you can use the multiverse to do so, but why give Jeph Loeb a connection to the MCU?)--far easier, if he ever wants to use the character, to reboot her and start fresh. This would not be, unlike Daredevil, a way to generate buzz (assuming you think the MCU needs buzz).

Speaking of Daredevil, as part of the launch, Sutton repeated his claim that Charlie Cox would return to the role (providing no new evidence or speculation, just the same points we've heard before). As I said then, I don't buy it (for many, many reasons). Keep in mind I'm not saying it's impossible, just that I don't believe Feige will do it.

Disney Plus Launch Snafus: What Went Wrong? - Variety

post from a friend of Murphy's (Edward Rose) goes on at length at a 'discovery' via talking to customer support on Disney+ that there are more plans to put films on premiere access. The 'surprise' is due to Bob Chapek saying Mulan's release there was a 'one-off,' but really, is this a surprise? Exclusive content has always been the way to drive subscribers to streaming and if people will pay an additional fee for feature films, why wouldn't Disney shoot for the moon? The implication I think Rose is trying to make is that maybe we'll see Marvel films like this one day, but that's preposterous--MCU films are too expensive and too profitable for the limited gains on-offer (Mulan's sacrifice to the streaming gods seems due to how poorly Disney expects it to perform in theaters, otherwise the incredibly expensive film would have been dragged in front of audiences no matter what). There may be a future where streaming makes enough money to support tent-pole films, but it's not the reality right now.

Image result for spider-woman"

Deadline reports that Olivia Wilde has signed to direct a female-lead Marvel film for Sony, which will have a script from Katie Silberman and is being produced by Amy Pascal. I've gone over previously that none of Pascal (or Avi Arad's) Sony-Marvel projects have gone into production, meaning if this is purely a Sony effort it's unlikely to happen. The project (speculated to be Spider-Woman) seemingly will have to wait until Wilde finishes a film for Universal that has Pascal and the same writer attached (something Deadline gave no title or date for).

So we can dismiss this, right? We can't because of the Murphy comments above (about a hypothetical MCU joint production). Let's briefly go over the Spider-Woman background among scoopers in terms of what's going on:

  • January 2019 - Murphy reports that Jessica Drew was originally in Far From Home, but was cut and replaced by Nick Fury and Maria Hill (meaning the MCU has had her in mind for awhile)
  • October - Sutton (who has good contacts at Sony) puts Jessica Drew on a long-term spec list (which means an R&D list)
  • February - A guy who is part of The Super Suit Show (which I've never heard of; his creation Free World Comic has been suspended by Twitter for violations, which is odd to say the least), who is considered a reliable source by Murphy, said a movie was coming
  • February - Daniel says the film was in the works two months earlier
  • February (same link) - TI says Sony is eyeing Michelle MacLaren to direct (which, if true, went nowhere--she's currently set to direct episodes of Coyote)
  • February (same link) - Murphy says the project is via Pascal/Rachel O'Connor, who have been involved in the MCU Spidey films
  • February (same link) - Murphy says they are looking for a 25-35 year old actress for the role
  • March - Murphy said Feige was interested in making a Jessica Drew film with Sony and that talks had occurred
  • June - Murphy, re-visiting the issue, clarifies that the February documentation is unequivocal that Sony (with or without the MCU) is working on a Jessica Drew Spider-Woman film

If Murphy is correct (and I see no reason to doubt him) and this is the Jessica Drew iteration of the character, it's hard not to imagine it's being done by Feige and the MCU. The only alternative view of this is if the new deal signed in the fall gave Sony permission to do it on their own or they are doing the character without the usual comicbook background. What's confusing the issue for me is that the MCU hasn't been at all involved in promoting the project, which you'd think they would if they're involved. Ultimately, it's hard to parse which way this will go.

Following this news (also from Deadline) we learned the long moribund Kraven the Hunter film was in talks with director J. C. Chandor to join the project. This film is Avi Arad's, so to repeat, nothing from Arad has been produced up to now. Chandor might be working on the TV-series The Connection first, although it's not clear what happened to his 'first-look' deal that he signed three years ago (IMDB says it's planned for this year, but I couldn't find confirmation for that). Regardless, I wouldn't see this project as 'coming soon' based on this news.

My original opinion on this was that it's an inexpensive attempt by Sony to put pressure on Disney--'hey, we don't need you--we've got our own Marvel staple of characters'--all in an effort to get a better deal once the current one expires (this approach only works if the upcoming films perform well). Then I said there's an outside chance that Sony wants to sell Sony Pictures to Marvel and this is a way to drive up the price, but there's no real rush for Disney to do so since the Spider-Man IP can't go to anyone else. The ambiguity of Spider-Woman makes it less clear how coordinated this is, although ultimately the broader points remain the same.

Ancillary stock image. Image of dictionary, paper, word - 114408207

I briefly want to touch on an unrelated story to make a broader point that at some point will apply to MCU IP. Deadline reports Netflix has cancelled the second season of The Society and not renewed I Am Not Okay With This, blaming the pandemic. This is what I want to address from Nellie Andreeva's article:

both [shows were] well received by critics and fans and had strong support at Netflix

I do not believe the middle part of that statement at all--if fans were flocking to the shows, both would be moving forward. This kind of unsupported statement is something I see all the time in a Marvel context, where declared fan enthusiasm has no supporting facts and it drives me crazy. A hit show does not get cancelled. The only reason Netflix gets rid of a show is because it no longer drives subscription numbers (or, rarely, for reasons of corporate competition, ala Daredevil, but that doesn't apply here). Occasionally, the immense cost of a show (ala genre entertainment like Star Trek: Discovery, WestworldThe Witcher, or Amazon's Lord of the Rings prequel) demands multiple seasons to recoup the investment, which in turn gives us endless articles proclaiming how successful they are no matter what the truth is. Critical darlings do occasionally get renewed despite public disinterest, but these are typically cheap productions, some sort of flagship, or the pet project of a powerful executive. To sum up: someone simply saying a show is popular doesn't hold water without the numbers to back it up and if you don't see those numbers I'd be highly suspicious that whatever argument you're reading is baseless.

This article is written by Peter Levi (@eyeonthesens)

Sunday, August 16, 2020

Marvel News & Notes

Disney Plus Launch Snafus: What Went Wrong? - Variety

Murphy made some interesting comments (I've edited them down to the key points):
Crews for The Falcon and The Winter Solider, Loki and Hawkeye moved back into town and got the ball rolling again on the three upcoming series, joining the crew for the Untitled Spider-Man Sequel, which had previously begun prep work. The past week saw crews return to their projects’ offices, stages being built and pre-production steps taken that should ensure both The Falcon and The Winter Solider and Loki are able to resume filming sometime in late-August or early-September. Back in early July, the studio had hoped to resume filming on those projects by August 17th. A recent report indicated a late-October start for Hawkeye and, as I reported a few months ago, the Spidey sequel is expected to begin filming in September (though the recent release date shift does give them a month to play with). [With] WandaVision we continue to hear they have work to complete in Los Angeles. The return of crews [likely means] The Falcon and The Winter Soldier will be completed in enough time for the series to stream before the end of 2020. It also means casting news might begin to trickle out for Hawkeye and Spidey 3 over the next several weeks.

I distinctly recall the October rumour he references about Hawkeye, but I apparently did not record it, so I'm not sure of the source. I assume the WandaVision work refers to re-shoots, since we know the show had completed principal photography. Overall, the news matches my expectations for what's happening--full steam ahead and with an earlier start than some were expecting.

Ms. Marvel Disney+ Show Logo Revealed

The Illuminerdi (Nebens) has casting calls for Ms. Marvel (for about the source of their information, see below):

"The male, with the code name Omar, is listed as a Pakistani American in his mid-to-late 20’s, a practicing Muslim and a self-proclaimed wiser older brother. He is also listed as modern and spirited.
"The female, code named Willow, is listed as a 16 to 20 year old American teenager of Turkish, Moroccan, or Arab decent. Active in student organizations with a love of being in charge, she is described as a hijabi Muslim, woke, popular, stylish and smart.

Keep in mind this isn't a quote from the casting call, but a paraphrase by Nebens. He reasonably guesses the first is Kamala's brother Aamir, while the latter is her friend Nakia Bahadir. The notice includes a production date of November-March. Both of these are expected characters for the IP, so nothing that really hints at how the MCU wants to tell her story (which, thus far, seems very small and young adult). I'm curious just how 'woke' they'll make Bahadir, I doubt that's the word used on the sheet, as the last thing Marvel wants is to step into the culture war they've largely avoided (most of our scoopers spend their free time fighting it, so they insert the battle into their material).

Nebens then posted another 'scoop' on The Direct, accidentally giving away his source, which is Daniel:

According to an insider who has been a very reliable source for industry info relating to the MCU [aka Daniel], the Hawkeye mini-series is currently casting for Eastern European actors to play a gang of mobsters who will appear in multiple episodes. Audition notes describe a scene where these mobsters break into a guarded building to retrieve an object that had been stolen from them. The context of the scene and the dialogue throughout it indicate that this object is some type of Novichok agent (chemical weapon).

I assume Daniel farmed this out to Nebens, just like he's previously done with former GWW writers (more about this below), otherwise Nebens wouldn't need to say a 'source' since he'd have direct access to Production Weekly himself. This suggests all the scoops on The Illuminerdi are via Daniel. In that sense, Daniel is propping up an entire ecosystem of fan sites that are otherwise filled with identical, generic content (you can't find comment on TI articles, which tells you something). This is similar in spirit to what Sutton does, although his work largely appears on Youtube and he doesn't use Production Weekly (why he doesn't, I have no idea). Nebens used to work at MCU Exchange, which was the original home of Charles Murphy and is still run by his buddy Charles Villanueva--I assume this indirect connection is why Daniel doesn't poach Murphy's info (as he's been caught doing with others), even if the don't seem to cooperate on content. An aside: Murphy/Villanueva also seem to have access to Production Weekly (I have no idea if its directly or through Daniel's Patreon), despite which Murphy never seems to step on Daniel's toes--whether that's via arrangement or not I have no idea.

NEW SPIDER-MAN 3 DETAILS HINT AT PLOT - YouTube

Murphy claims the MCU is looking for a 'Joel Kinnaman-type" for a role in Spider-Man 3 (information either from an agent or Production Weekly), and speculates this could be for Kraven. I've only seen Kinnaman act twice, in Suicide Squad and Altered Carbon, and thought he was unremarkable in both, but given that the actor himself is unlikely to be cast that's neither here nor there. While the identification of the role has to be taken with a grain of salt, it seems like a villain and probably someone who could fit the Sinister Six (since that's what we've had in the first two films).

Who Is Marvel's BLUE MARVEL? (Superman + Mr. Fantastic + Black ...

Sutton says Blue Marvel is on the way (echoing what he said very recently). It's an interesting scoop because Sutton says the character has a cult following, something I can't verify at all--I checked Google Trends and popularity lists and he's a non-factor; he also doesn't sell books by appearing in them (his usual team, The Ultimates, can't make it beyond 13-issues). Sutton speculates Carl Lumbly could have the role in Falcon and the Winter Soldier, even though that's not thematically on target for the IP (unlike the common assumption that he's Isaiah Bradley)--and how would a Superman-like character fit into the grounded story of that show? Sutton says the character is being considered for the Agents of SWORD show, which is a plausible. I don't buy the Lumbly guess at all, but could the character appear? Sure, but (as I said in the link above), the only reason I can think of would be to beat DC to the punch of a black Superman (otherwise, why add a character who echoes Captain Marvel?).

Champions (1975 team) - Wikipedia

On his Geekosity page Sutton has been hinting at an MCU-version of the 1970s Champions and those hints echo one of his R&D listsChampions was a short-lived (17-issue) effort from Tony Isabella (75-78), with a weird lineup: HerculesBlack WidowGhost RiderAngel, and Iceman; later joined by Darkstar, with intentions to add Black Goliath (aka Bill Foster, who appeared in Ant-Man and the Wasp) and Jack of Hearts. I'm not sure what the impetus would be for a team like this--that doesn't mean it's impossible or it can't work, just that I'm not sure what niche it would be filling (it reminds me of his Defenders scoop in May--another weird 70s group that felt like a dumping ground for disparate characters). I don't think the MCU can support that many super groups occupying the same thematic space--the team would basically be an iteration of the Avengers and the reason comics like this never last long is because they are derivative (each team needs a very specific angle to be unique enough to thrive).

Image result for rumour word

Sutton Q&A (one and two, my comments in pink):

  • Said the MCU would welcome Hugh Jackman back, but there are no current talks or rumours and because of his age his role would be limited [This is the exact same answer he gave to this question in June; back in September he said the role of Wolverine was Jackman's to turn down, which echoed LotLB at the time (this via their original source, 'The Black Knight'); he repeated the idea in December; Sutton's current stance is the one I had from the beginning, which was that Jackman's age limits what he can do and his own comments make it clear he isn't interested in returning as Wolverine because Logan was such a good ending for the character]
  • Luke Cage is coming back, but Sutton doesn't know where; Tim said the last thing he heard is that Mike Colter would not be back [Back in September Sutton said all the original actors were coming back and would join the MCU--via that link you can see me dispute all the evidence provided--in November he cut out Finn Jones, saying he'd be recast, but as recently as July he was repeating the general September assertion, so the idea of no Colter is a significant change; this also looks like a revision on Luke Cage, because in May Sutton said he would be part of a New Avengers team, but while he doesn't specify that here he repeated it to me personally when I asked him about it]
  • Mutants will appear before Namor; Dwayne Johnson unlikely to be involved because of timing [I don't understand the struggle to give up on Johnson in the MCU--he's in DC films, he's too old, and he's too expensive; that aside, you don't need someone like him for a character who can't have their own film anyway (because of the rights situation with Universal); on the other hand, the idea of mutants first seems likely as I expect them before Black Panther 2, which is the earliest we're likely to see Namor--keep in mind that Sutton believes Marvel has regained the rights to Namor via some old comments by Joe Quesada, evidence I've debunked, cf, but even if the rights were back, it can't be Johnson given the aforementioned factors]
  • X-Men before any other mutant team; no current plans for Bishop [Absolutely and I'm not surprised--whatever cache Bishop might have for some, he doesn't register on popularity lists and he's not a key part of the iconic mutant stories]
  • Shia Labeouf not currently up for any role [I have no idea why these rumours persist--trolls? While he continues to get work, no one is running out to see him in anything]
  • Upcoming MCU antagonists: first Kang, then Doctor Doom on earth and Galactus in space [Sutton first proposed Kang in February, with other scoopers (Murphy and Daniel) putting him in Loki; the later idea has been Sutton's since September]
  • Has heard nothing and doubts we will see Korvac [Rumours about the character go back to Reddit last June, which LotLB debunked last August]

It's hard not to think those early thoughts about Wolverine were derived this way: Feige had talked to Jackman in the fall, Ryan Reynolds wanted him in Deadpool 3, so.... It's an exciting prospect, even if Jackman is too old to reboot the character for the MCU (and it would deny Feige the clean slate he wants for the IP). I always thought Feige's calls to Jackman and Stewart were pure courtesy, as both have said Logan was the send-off they wanted, which is why I never bought into the idea.

Secondly, the Netflix characters: this idea is not unique to Sutton--lot's of people have parroted it (every scooper not named Murphy)--nor was he the first to suggest it (Conrad gets that distinction). However, unlike most (who are simply peddling clickbait), Sutton actually provided five points of evidence for why he thought this, which is fantastic. The fact that I rejected each point (link above) doesn't diminish the fact that he's providing backing--I can understand the reason why he'd make the leap of faith. Ultimately, I don't think the idea ever made sense in a post-Marvel Entertainment world and, I suspect, Sutton will gradually give up on the other actors soon enough (Colter, Ritter, and Jones are already committed to other shows, while Bernthal is signed through the next few years on various projects--all, other than Jones, are also far too old for an MCU reboot).

The one-two punch of Galactus and Doctor Doom would be incredible, but I have to wonder if that's the MCU blowing its load a bit too early--do you want to use both in the same epic sequence? It's possible, but I have doubts.

Alpha Flight (1983-1994) #17 - Comics by comiXology

For anyone who missed it, I wrote a long and detailed look at what an MCU version of Alpha Flight could look like--I'd love to hear opinions regarding the IP.

Agents-of-Shield-Logo - MTR Network

Dunking on Conrad is old hat at this point--he does it to himself often enough--but occasionally what he says is worth exploring for reasons beyond his self-inflicted foibles. Like most people, I don't follow his social media, but those who do occasionally transmit his words to other mediums. The night before the Agents of SHIELD finale (or, putting it more accurately, after the screeners had already come out), he claimed the episode was going to definitively tie the show to the MCU (which he echoed on his site afterwards). The episode came out and the show included... the Quantum Realm! This had Conrad proclaiming: yes, it's all connected! Why is this revelation irrelevant? Because the show has already had Nick FuryMaria Hill, and Sif show up and it didn't matter (the MCU did not respect those appearances at all--Coulson has been dead in the MCU since The Avengers). There's a significant slice of people who cover Marvel (eg) who can't accept what's been obvious from the beginning (eg): Feige won't acknowledge the show. He didn't want it when it began and he certainly doesn't now. It's never been a problem of could the IP be included, simply a fact that it won't be.

New Mutants: Where does it fit into the crazy X-Men movie timeline ...

GWW's K. C. Walsh (best known to me for drama; he's not a scooper, so doesn't come up often) flippantly Tweeted that New Mutants will hit Disney+ in 2-3 weeks, something he's aware is impossible (the film is contracted to go to HBO after its theatrical release). I bring this up just to repeat some basic information: we all understand that Disney could pay to get the streaming rights immediately, but there's no reason for them to do so--it's not part of the MCU and has evoked little interest--the film is coming out because it's free money. If the MCU was actually interested the film they would have paid for the long-needed re-shoots that never happened.    

Trivia word stock illustration. Illustration of knowledgeable ...

Since it's on my mind, I thought I'd look at the web of Daniel as it relates to the scooper sphere (as in, who appears to have him as their source for information)--scoops refers specifically to the MCU. What I mean by 'direct' is that Daniel would have to communicate with them directly to provide the information; 'indirect' means that communication isn't necessary (just access to his Patreon)--for those unfamiliar with Daniel's material, he only ever paraphrases what he gets from Production Weekly (it's likely part of the TOS for the site) and often does so in a very limited way.

Direct
Thomas Polito – Cinema Spot, formerly GWW, formerly Revenge of the Fans (last scoop: May)
Vicky Depledge – formerly Cinema Spot, formerly GWW (last scoop: May)—‘stepped down’ in June without moving on to anything else (which is very odd--she's still active on social media and still lists both sites as if she was still working for them)
Richard Nebens – The Direct/The Illuminerdi; formerly MCU Exchange and I believe That Hashtag Show (last scoop: August for both)—oddly, doesn’t include TI or THS in his Direct bio
Joe Deckelmeier – Screen Rant/The Illuminerdi; formerly That Hashtag Show (last scoop: last August)--he now does celebrity interviews for SR and writes non-MCU stuff for TI
Braxter Timberlake – The Illuminerdi; formerly That Hashtag Show (last scoop: July)
Brandon Zachary – The Illuminerdi; formerly That Hashtag Show (last scoop: February)—no longer covers MCU material for them

Indirect
Caleb Williams – Knight Edge Media, formerly GWW

I've mentioned before that Murphy knows most of these people--he worked at MCU Exchange and That Hashtag Show, but it remains unclear what association (if any) he has with Daniel. Since Murphy left both prior sites, their scoops have evaporated, suggesting he was the only person with sources (which, as I've gone over before, are a mix of Production Weekly, set reports/photos/videos, social media hunting, and agent/s).

One final, somewhat related thought: I'm not clear on how Pierre Chanliau, best known for a now very outdated scooper authenticity page, is a Marvel Reddit mod while writing for MCU Exchange and The Direct. It seems like a conflict of interest and a cynical mind has to wonder about the initial flood of Direct posts that appeared after his arrival that had no place there. In the grand scheme of things it doesn't really matters (any site like Reddit is going to have moderation problems), it's just something I noticed.

This article is written by Peter Levi (@eyeonthesens)

Tuesday, August 11, 2020

Alpha Flight MCU Speculation

Alpha Flight comic books issue 17What Movie Studio Owns the Rights to Alpha Flight? - The Geek Twins

Prompted by the recent rumours about Alpha Flight, this is an exploration of what an MCU version of the team could be. Let me preface this by saying I remain skeptical that they will have their own show or film, although I think it's highly probable they will appear as part of Wolverine's origin. In my process of researching this I read through all 170+ issues of the various iterations of Alpha Flight (which was exhausting, but interesting)--previously I'd only read Byrne's run and the 2019 one-shot.

This is a long article, so I've divided it into sections to make it easier for you to navigate. One thing to point out before we start: the IP, while obscure, is still more popular than The Eternals (which hits theaters relatively soon)--that's a group whose longest run was twelve-issues and Marvel hasn't tried to revive since 2009. I mention this as food for thought among those who might be even more pessimistic than I am about the possibility of Alpha Flight (granting that Eternals was given the green light pre-Fox sale, when there wasn't much internal competition). For context I've listed the various Eternals in my character breakdown below (excluding Black Knight, because he's not from that IP), as it indicates the relative prevalence of the members within the comics.

The Rumours

Tackling them chronologically:
  • Last July - LotLB ('The Black Knight') said Machine Man was coming (claiming there was concept art of Machine Man with Starlord and with Thor and Hercules)--I'm including this because there's a tiny possibility that part of the reason Machine Man was being researched is Alpha Flight's early appearance in Machine Man #18 (it's admittedly a big stretch on my part)
  • September - Sutton said the team will appear in the context of a Hulk vs Wolverine film that's under discussion at Marvel (that film echoing a desire expressed by the Russo brother's earlier, but they've never mentioned Alpha Flight to my knowledge); this was echoed by LotLB; Sutton later added that the title being considered was Weapon X (Hulk's name can't appear in the title due to the rights situation with Universal)
  • May - Sutton said the Wolverine film will come after the first X-Men film (the former being known as Weapon X in that film), which means Alpha Flight would follow their introduction (and therefore not arrive any time soon--2024 seems like the earliest date)
  • June (same link) - Sutton clarified that in the X-Men film, Weapon X doesn't join the team and returns to Canada as a wanted man; Alpha Flight (in his solo film) is sent to hunt him down (the team: Vindicator [meaning, in my effort to simplify the monikers for he and his wife, Guardian], NorthstarAuroraSasquatchShamanSnowbird, and Puck--this matches the lineup used in the animated X-Men, not the comics); he said the MCU see's a potential Disney+ show for the group after the film; he also added that Sasquatch is of particular interest to Marvel (not saying why--my guess is that it's either related to the character's gender change or the evil creature bound up inside him--probably the former)
  • June (same link) - Daniel repeated the basic information ("There are plans for Alpha Flight to show up in the MCU") without attribution or additional information--clearly he's repeating Sutton's rumour
  • June (same link) - Murphy, in response to Daniel's rumour, said he heard pre-Disney+ (pre-September, 2017) that Feige was interested in Alpha Flight, without saying where he heard that; people often report that Feige likes something, but Murphy is credible enough that I actually believe him
  • July - Sutton put SnowbirdMarrina, and Talisman on an R&D list (the latter specifically in a Disney+ context)
The idea of Alpha Flight in the MCU comes from Sutton and he's the only person offering substance behind the idea. While I believe Murphy when he says there's interest from Feige, let's keep in mind Feige has been interested in Power Pack for the last fifteen years and still hasn't produced a show or film for them (ergo, interest doesn't always equal action, albeit Power Pack isn't integrated into something else that's really popular). Whether the specifics above are correct or not, the simplest way to introduce Alpha Flight is either through Wolverine, the X-Men, or Captain Marvel (whom they have a relatively recent association with via SWORD). The former idea provides a lot more punch than the latter, since Wolverine's origin is tied-up with Alpha Flight.

The Appeal

This is the fundamental question: why bother? Fox never used them despite the connection to their biggest character, so why does Feige? There are three answers to this question, which I've listed in what I think is the order of importance for the MCU:
1) Wolverine's origin: while his background is an ever changing mess in the comics, at all points Alpha Flight has been a key element and because Fox ignored it they become hugely appealing to Feige (who said he wants to do things differently)
2) Diverse/unique/distinctive characters: this is a long list, particularly from an 80s IP:
  • Native heroes (I'm using the American term since it's likely the most familiar to non-Canadians--I believe First Peoples is the most accepted term in Canada right now, covering First Nations, Metis, and Inuit)
  • Francophone heroes
  • The first openly gay Marvel hero
  • Disabled hero
  • A character with dwarfism
  • Hero who switches genders
  • Hero with mental health issues (multiple personalities--an issue presumably preempted by Moon Knight, although we don't know how hard Marvel will lean into that and their struggles are quite different regardless)
  • Half-goddess hero (we've had gods in the MCU, but this is distinctive)
  • Hero who is of a savage alien race raised by humans
  • Hero unknowingly has an evil spirit inside them
  • Hero's body is a trap for an evil demon/sorcerer inside them
  • Heroes who use magic
  • Hero who is a shapechanger
  • Team leader who initially has no powers
  • Team leader who is female
Many of these checkboxes will have been addressed by the MCU before Alpha Flight appears, but there's no classic team that encompasses them all organically
3) Popularity of the IP: this might seem an odd thing to say, as I'll repeat that it's not that popular in a general sense, but in relative terms Alpha Flight is more popular than The Eternals, the rumoured Agents of Atlas, The Champions, etc. It's far down the scale of mutant-associated groups (all iterations of the X-Men, X-Factor, X-Force, Excalibur, and The New Mutants), but it does have limited cache

The Team

Many MCU fans have no idea who or what Alpha Flight is. In brief, they are a Canadian superhero team usually under the umbrella of the Canadian government. They typically function within Department H, a branch that monitors all superhuman activity within the country (originally part of the RCMP, but CSIS now performs that function). In the lore Wolverine was intended to be Weapon Alpha (the context for this has changed a number of times--Alpha Flight 17 seems to imply Wolverine voluntarily involved himself and was already a Canadian agent, something that changed in Alpha Flight 33; once Guardian was responsible for the experimentation, then Department K--sometimes Logan served in the Devil's Brigade in WW2--and yet more changes in Alpha Flight volume 2/8, etc). James Hudson (aka Guardian) becomes Weapon Alpha once Logan leaves to join the X-Men. It's trivial, but the order of recruitment for Alpha Flight is: Wolverine, then Shaman and Snowbird; Wolverine recruits Aurora; Guardian recruits Northstar, who only stays when he realizes his hitherto unknown sister is on the team; finally, Snowbird finds Sasquatch post-experiment). One of the first things the team is assigned to do is bring Wolverine back to Canada, because he's considered government property. He and Guardian are friends and eventually talk it out (in X-Men 147 it's emphasized that the married couple, ie Guardian and his wife, tried hard to help Logan while he was in the organization).

So, Alpha Flight is a Canadian superhero group with a strong government connection (either current or in the past). They've often had subsets of the team known as Beta Flight and/or Gamma Flight who play a prominent role in the plot. John Byrne, the original writer of the comic, used the B-teams as a source for character building and as a way to develop antagonists. My focus is the main team, but I'll note the versions of those developmental teams below (sometimes untangling which group a character is part of isn't easy, as various writers have put B-teamers with the A-team in virtually every adventure, making the distinction almost moot).

Here are the various iterations through its first and only successful run (I'll go through the others below); those newly joining are in green, while those in red left; keep in mind that Guardian has also been called Vindicator and Weapon Alpha, while Vindicator has also been called Guardian, but to differentiate the two I'm using just one name for each; what's below is simplified to avoid the tedious and trivial issue-by-issue comings & goings:
  • X-Men 109 (78; Byrne/Claremont): Guardian
  • X-Men 120-21/139-40/Machine Man 18/Marvel Two-in-One 83-84 (79/80/82; Byrne/Claremont): Guardian, Northstar, Sasquatch, Aurora, Shaman, Snowbird
  • Alpha Flight 1-28/Rom 56-58 (83; Byrne): Guardian (dies), Northstar, Sasquatch (dies Hulk 313), Aurora, Shaman, Snowbird, PuckMarrina (leaves twice), Talisman, Box
  • Beta Flight (Alpha Flight 1): Puck, Marrina, Box, and Flashback
  • Gamma Flight (Alpha Flight 1): Diamond Lil, Madison Jeffries, Wild Child, and Smart Alec
  • Alpha Flight 29-66 (85; Mantlo): Vindicator, Northstar (leaves), Sasquatch (as a woman), Aurora (leaves), Shaman (leaves), Snowbird (dies), Puck (leaves), Talisman (leaves), Box (dies), Madison JeffriesKara Killgrave
  • Beta Flight (50-66): Purple Girl, Manikin, Goblyn, Pathway
  • Alpha Flight 67-89 (89; Hudnall): Vindicator, Northstar, Sasquatch (as a man), Aurora, Shaman, PuckTalisman, Madison Jeffries, Kara Killgrave (leaves), Goblyn (leaves), Diamond Lil
  • Gamma Flight (76-90): Wildchild, Witchfire, Nemsis, Auric, Silver
  • Alpha Flight 87-101 (90; Nicieza): Guardian (dies), Vindicator, Northstar, Sasquatch, Aurora, Shaman, Puck, Talisman (injured), Madison Jeffries, Kara Killgrave, Diamond Lil, WitchfireWindshear
  • Alpha Flight 102-108 (91; Lobdell): Vindicator, Northstar, Sasquatch, Aurora, Shaman, Puck, Madison Jeffries, Kara Killgrave, Diamond Lil, Witchfire, Wild Child
  • Alpha Flight 109-130 (92; Furman): Guardian, Vindicator, Northstar, Sasquatch, Aurora, Shaman, Puck, TalismanMadison Jeffries (leaves), Kara Killgrave, Diamond Lil (leaves), Witchfire, Wild Child, Goblyn
  • Beta Flight (119-130): Talisman, Feedback, Witchfire

The Post-Byrne Failures

Alpha Flight Vol 1 61 | Marvel Database | FandomAlpha Flight Vol 1 80 | Marvel Database | FandomAlpha Flight Vol 1 107 | Marvel Database | FandomAlpha Flight Vol 1 125 | Marvel Database | Fandom

Byrne is revered as one of the greatest writers and artists of his era and, at least for this IP, all the writers who followed him have struggled to approach his standard:
  • Bill Mantlo - An innovative writer whose career was ended by a horrific hit and run that left him with permanent brain damage; his time with the IP has some good early moments, but doesn't reach Byrne's level--he gradually shifted the focus to new characters who simply don't work, while those originals who remain are largely unrecognizable (he seemed to delight in Vindicator making mistakes); the stories themselves become generic (the entire Dreamqueen arc was a slog, AF 57-64) and disconnected from the setting; the only interesting change he made was Sasquatch's gender swap, but he never pursued it as much as he could have
  • James Hudnall - Wrote comics from 1985 to the late 90s, but his work strikes me as mediocre; he smartly rotated most of the Byrne characters back in and moved away from the tedious romance between Vindicator/Jeffries; his villains are cartoony and his characters fall flat; his one innovation is a small one, and that was making Diamond Lil an actual character
  • Fabian Nicieza - A notable innovator, but we see virtually none of that here; he leaned heavily on gimmicks, such as bringing back Guardian to kill him off again, along with innumerable guest stars from bigger IP while pumping out generic stories; he ignored most of the original characters, but did nothing to make the newer ones more interesting
  • Scott Lobdell - Well-known, but doesn't stand out to me (his short stint does not seem to have informed his second attempt with the IP); his brief tenure couldn't be more generic, although he did pull Aurora out of psychiatric treatment where Nicieza had left her (otherwise it's mindless fighting and guest appearances)
  • Simon Furman - Known primarily for writing Transformer comics; he tries to imitate some of Byrne's throughlines, but it comes across as imitation and he's unable to evolve character arcs forward organically; like everyone else, he couldn't make newer characters 'pop' (who, as in all the other cases, are featured heavily); the run is dominated by mindless action; he brings back Guardian in the last issue
I don't think any of the runs after Byrne were successful--Mantlo's is the best, but it's very uneven and gradually gets worse, as he spent far too much time on characters no one cares about (then or now). One of the big mistakes made here (and below) is the wholesale changes in character focus--unlike Claremont with the X-Men, who tended to add just one or two new characters at a time, each writer made big, sweeping changes that included minimizing the originals--that simply doesn't work. Despite that, lasting 130 issues indicates the IP had cache and because of that Marvel has regularly tried to reengage that interest:

Alpha Flight (1997 2nd Series) 12Alpha Flight (2004) #11 | Comic Issues | MarvelAlpha Flight (2011) #1 (Eaglesham Variant) | Comic Issues | Marvel
  • 1997 - Steve Seagle was given the reins and kept it going for 20-issues; Seagle is an award winning writer, but he also failed with his new characters (Flex is dead, Manbot hasn't appeared since, and Murmur and Radius have only had inglorious easter eggs since--all are terribly generic); the de-aged (and de-cyborg'd) Guardian adds something to the dynamic; changing Vindicator's powers was presumably to differentiate she & her husband, but it's worked into the plot nicely; the writing is good and the main plot well executed, with Seagle ably handling the 'evil organization' trope for Department H; his idea of slowly rebuilding to the classic team makes sense; the only waste is the Sunfire arc--if cut nothing would change; the art (primarily Scott Clark and Duncan Roleau) is atrocious; this run is a bit of a lost opportunity, as Seagle is the best writer to tackle the IP outside of Byrne and while not perfect, it's the only one of these revivals that had potential
  • 2004 - Former Alpha Flight writer Scott Lobdell had a twelve issue run; like Seagle, his additions failed (Centennial, Major Mapleleaf, Nemesis III, Puck's daughter, and Yukon Jack)--in order they are: dead, dead, dead, dead, and not seen since the run ended; Lobdell went for an irreverent tone (ala Peter David's X-Factor), which is unique for the IP and occasionally effective; we get the repeated premise of assembling the team with a strong focus on new characters, but they lack depth (Yukon Jack talking like Thor is a weird choice)--Puck's daughter and Mapleleaf are the most entertaining, although Lobdell never takes the opportunity to work on the father-daughter dynamic for the child Puck abandoned (a decision that makes no sense whatsoever given Puck's portrayals elsewhere); we see Flashback return for the first time in a long time, and Lobdell's final issue provided the opportunity of a clean slate by potentially deleting everything after the first Omega Flight story in Alpha Flight 12--this is an opportunity Pak/Van Lente did not pursue
  • 2009 - X-Men: The Beginning: I bring this up because this is when Aurora was firmly given additional personalities (I don't know which writer was responsible for them: any of Paul Cornell, Jason Aaron, or Simon Spurrier), a change Pak/Van Lente largely ignored
  • 2011 - Greg Pak and Fred Van Lente (both very able writers, although they've written nothing I've felt compelled to read) had the IP for nine issues; they opened with the original team largely intact, using the leading pair's daughter as a source of tension; they followed the Seagle model of strife with the government as the main point of conflict, but it's less sinister (leaning towards cartoony); I liked their more confident iteration of Marrina, but ultimately the short run feels like a retreading of what we've seen before (albeit, with the most competent depiction of Byrne's characters since he left)
  • 2016 - While not its own IP, the Alpha Flight Space Program was introduced, which includes most of the original members (excluding Marrina and Vindicator); the org is heavily integrated into SWORD and Captain Marvel
  • 2019 - A one-shot reunion of the team featuring writers Jim Zub (who is excellent), Jed MacKay (a relatively new writer), and Ed Brisson (a solid contributor); I don't know how well this was received (Zub's part is good but ephemeral; MacKay's adds some character depth for Puck, but it's also ephemeral (echoing, to some extent, Alpha Flight 14-15); Brisson tries to set-up a way forward, but it lacks dramatic tension--leaning on elements from the 2011 series that aren't very interesting); no new independent comic has shown up since, but most of the members are active elsewhere (the exceptions being Marrina, Snowbird, and Vindicator)
The revivals have been increasingly shorter, which follows the general trend at Marvel, but I don't think the problem is the team's eccentricity or the Canadian setting. The group needs a strong writer to make it work--it can't be merely adequate--but the Hickman's of the world aren't jumping to revive the team. Through eight post-Byrne writers we've had no non-core character make a splash (a few have potential--Diamond Lil, Witchfire, Puck's daughter, even Flashback), despite oceans of ink being spent trying to make that happen (to the detriment of evolving the core characters forward). I think Pak/Van Lente had the right idea of going back to Byrne's team, but did so in a fairly tired manner, recycling story material from the past rather than pushing forward. I also find it odd that none of the new attempts try to do anything with Talisman. We've also seen, going back to the OG run, that Byrne's successors struggled to keep the Canadian element relevant to their stories (something the revivals managed relatively well). In my opinion, if Marvel tries to revive it again, they need to start with the original team, make the setting important (Byrne is the only Canadian writer to work on the book), evolve the characters forward and try to create some new opposition--other than Seagle's version of Department H, none of the antagonists have been handled well.

The Characters

These are strictly from the original 130-issue run and are listed by number of appearances; I've cut a few of the short-lived members due to a low number of appearances or being ignored/dead in the comics forever--inexplicably Manikin showed up in Al Ewing's Valkyrie for a couple of issues after 26-years of inactivity, but I left him out anyway (in order of appearances/last seen the cuts are: Manikin (46/20), Pathway (44/94), the Jane Thorne Nemesis (23/94), Wyre (18/94), Silver (17/93), Auric (15/93), and Feedback (7/94):


Northstar (79; Byrne/Claremont) 356 (most recent X-Factor Sept/20)
Hot-tempered Francophone from Montreal; he is Aurora's twin (separated when their parents died in a car accident; they were so young when that happened that they did not find each other until they joined the team); combative with a stormy temperament; Marvel's first openly gay character (always intended by Byrne, but not something Marvel would allow revealed until 1990); Byrne is the only writer who spent time on evolving him, as the only notable thing since is his eventual husband (via Matt Fraction in 2009); a mutant, his powers include light generation, concussive blasts, superhuman speed, and flight; none of his affiliations have been significant (perhaps his current placement in X-Factor will change that); from The Eternals, Sersi has the most appearances (258)

Sasquatch - Marvel Comics - Alpha Flight - Walter Langkowski ...OMEGA FLIGHT 1of5 ALPHA FLIGHT Sasquatch Walter Langkowski ...Stories from the Toyshelf: The Doctor, The Demigod & The Great ...
Sasquatch (79; Byrne/Claremont) 352 (Tarot May/20)
From Vancouver; a scientist whose Gamma experiments merged him with a an evil being known as Tanaraq (one of the Great Beasts), allowing him to transform into Sasquatch; generally portrayed as a happy-go-lucky nerd (a synergy of Bruce Banner's brain and The Thing's personality); he's had a romantic relationship with Aurora; he's killed by Snowbird because of Tanaraq, but due to complicated circumstances he becomes female for a time, inhabiting Snowbird's body (Alpha Flight 45-68, something Hudnall reversed when he took over from Mantlo)--this is a change Aurora can't handle and rejects him--no writer has delved into this after the fact; powers include superhuman strength, speed, stamina, and durability; none of his non-Alpha Flight affiliations are of note (except, perhaps, the recent Al Ewing Hulk-run, which I haven't had a chance to read); he could be a candidate for race-swapping (depending on how much value Marvel puts in him being Jewish); he's also a candidate for a gender swap if Marvel wants (either to start the character that way or have him change); from The Eternals, Makkari has the second most appearances (149)

Puck - Marvel Comics - Alpha Flight - Eugene Judd - Character ...
Puck (83; Byrne) 337 (Immortal Hulk Apr/20)
From Saskatoon; originally conceived of by Byrne as a Batman-like character, he was retconned to be the bodily prison of a sorcerer known as Black Raazer; his personality echoes Wolverine (another short, hairy, physical fighter, who is older than he looks and has a complicated past--he also shares an unrequited love with a redhead (in Puck's case Vindicator, ala Wolverine and Jean Grey), the pair also have some sort of connection via the Venezuelan city of Maracaibo (Alpha Flight 17) that's never explained); powers include superhuman strength, speed, durability, agility, reflexes, stamina, and longevity; unlike the characters above, he's played a significant supporting role for both Captain Marvel and Hulk outside the IP (meaning he could debut in another context); from The Eternals, Ikaris is third (123)

VINDICATOR II | uncannyxmen.net
Vindicator (80; Byrne/Claremont) 270 (Alpha Flight: True North Nov/19)
Also known as Guardian, but Vindicator is her most frequent alias; from Calgary where she knew Shaman as a child; she became involved with Guardian as a coworker and married him, assisting him with Alpha Flight before she took over his role (and eventually, the suit, in Alpha Flight 32); like her husband, she's a reluctant leader, but much more empathetic; she had a tedious romantic relationship with Jeffries that I think the MCU will ignore; Chuck Austen (of all people, cf) gave her a daughter (X-Men Unlimited 45); her powers are through the Vindicator suit, whose abilities include flight, a protective forcefield, concussive beams, graviton beam, and so on; she's never had an affiliation outside Alpha Flight (besides organizations that amount to the same thing), and is one of the few core characters from the IP that's currently inactive; from The Eternals, Thena is fourth (111)

Aurora (79; Byrne/Claremont) 241 (X-Factor Sept/20)
Francophone from Montreal; she's Northstar's twin (she was raised in an ultra-religious context whose restrictions lead to a suicide attempt); she's had a romantic relationship with Sasquatch (ending for a time when he switched genders); she's schizophrenic and has multiple personalities (Byrne originally gave her two, a conservative introvert and flirtatious extrovert); a mutant, her powers include light generation, concussive blasts, calming light, lightning, superhuman speed, flight, molecular acceleration (which can tear something apart), healing, and enhanced durability--the extent of all this has varied; like most of the characters above, none of her other affiliations have been very strong; from The Eternals, Gilgamesh is fifth (80)

Shaman (79; Byrne/Claremont) 235 (Strange Academy Sept/20)
Sarcee Reserve (aka Tsuu T'ina Nation; 'Sarcee' is considered offensive so wouldn't be used by the MCU)/Calgary; he grew up near Vindicator when she was young (he was a surgeon before he gained his powers, just like Doctor Strange); he also raised Snowbird; he fails to cure his wife of cancer and she dies, something his daughter Talisman blames him for since he promised to save her; he fulfills the classic (stereotypical) wise man/spiritual leader; his powers are through magic channeled through mystical objects; like Vindicator above, he's never had a strong association with another group, although over the last four years when he's appeared, it's largely in a Doctor Strange context; from The Eternals, Ajak is sixth (50)

Box - Marvel Comics - Alpha Flight - Madison Jeffries - Character ...
Madison Jeffries/Box (83; Byrne) 207 (Age of X-Man: Nextgen June/19)
Canadian, but without a specific location given (he served in Vietnam, Alpha Flight 89, along with 30,000 other volunteers from Canada); despite a lot of ink being spent on him, he's barely a character, defined primarily by his romances with Vindicator and Diamond Lil; a mutant, his powers include technokinetic transmutation (he can communicate with and possess machines), and intuitive invention (similar to occasional X-Men, Forge); with the former power he eventually becomes Box (the name for an armoured suit that provides superhuman strength, armour, and flight; it can also transform for Jeffries); he's largely a Mantlo/Hudnall character and had limited resonance as a peripheral X-Men since (rather than being brought back for Alpha Flight); from The Eternals, Phastos is seventh (36)


Guardian (78; Byrne/Claremont) 180 (Ravencroft Sept/20)
Also known as Vindicator and (briefly) Weapon Alpha; from London (Ontario); married to Vindicator; a reluctant hero, as he was originally an inventor who created the suit he wears for the Am-Can Petroleum company--when he heard his invention was being sold to the American military, he stole the suit and destroyed the records (eventually depicted in Alpha Flight 92)--he talks to the Canadian government who include him in the foundation of Department H; he has the classic Captain America traits where he's funded by the government but has a code (this exact comparison is made by Byrne early in the series, Alpha Flight 2)--this puts him in conflict with it (Mantlo would later retcon him to be a much more morally grey character, probably to make the romance between Vindicator and Jeffries more palatable, but later writers reverted to Byrne's approach); he's the original Alpha Flight leader and his suit's powers are the same as the Vindicator above; Byrne killed him early in his run (replaced by his wife); like his wife, he's never had an affiliation that wasn't Alpha Flight or something very similar; from The Eternals, Sprite is eighth (33)

Snowbird - Marvel Comics - Classic Alpha Flight - Character ...
Snowbird (79; Byrne/Claremont) 157 (Alpha Flight: True North Nov/19)
Resolute Bay; the daughter of the Inuit goddess Nelvanna (invented by Byrne) and a mortal man (her extremely Caucasian appearance is explained by the goddess taking a shape that her archaeologist father wanted--the process drove him mad and ultimately killed him); she was raised by Shaman; in terms of characterization she's focused on the goals of her mother (defeat the Great Beasts); Byrne tried to create conflict within this via a romantic relationship and a child, but while the basic idea is good, it's one of the only things I don't think Byrne handled well and has been ignored since; Mantlo killed her fairly early and she was not resurrected until Seagle's revival of the comic (her body, however, became Sasquatch's for the rest of Mantlo's run); powers include shapeshifting, flight, healing, superhuman strength, postcognition, mystical senses and resistance; like most of the members, she doesn't have any other strong affiliations; she's ripe for a race swap if the MCU wants to go that way (despite a pretty distinctive appearance--she doesn't look quite human); from The Eternals, Kingo is ninth (21)

Wild Child (83; Byrne) 146 (Hellions Sept/20)
From Vancouver; a mutant whose powers are based on an animal-like physiology (this gives him healing, superhuman senses, speed, stamina, agility, reflexes, fangs and claws, the ability to communicate and control wolves, and immunity from mind control); has flipped between psychopathic to attempting to reform, depending on the writer (Furman invested the most time in him)--he's very derivative of Wolverine/Sabertooth; he has a fairly strong association with other mutant teams (as well as spending time as a villain), and I think it's more likely we see him in that context rather than as a member of Alpha Flight

Talisman Elizabeth "Liz" Twoyoungmen is the only daughter by the ...
Talisman (83; Byrne) 118 (Doctor Strange Annual Dec/19)
Calgary; daughter of Shaman; other than being young and angry with her father for failed promises, she was never given much substance; she is another magic-based character (also largely dependent on mystical objects); besides Byrne none of the other writers spent much time with her (simply echoing the Byrne beats); like her father, she has started to crop up in a Doctor Strange context; there's a good chance she takes her father's place on the team for gender parity reasons and to avoid the possibility of using a stereotype

Marrina in 2020 | Alpha flight, Marvel comics, Marvel
Marrina (83; Byrne) 89 (Alpha Flight: True North Nov/19)
Lady Cove, Newfoundland; a Plodex alien with imprinted human DNA; she was raised by the locals, with her unusual appearance bringing her to the attention of Alpha Flight; she struggles with her heritage and fitting in (only in the Pak/Van Lente run, decades later, is she happy with herself); her Plodex heritage can cause her to become savage and homicidal; she left the team early, became Namor's partner and a member of the Avengers for a short time before being killed off; her closest friend on Alpha Flight is Puck; her abilities include the dual nature of an amphibian, limited shapechanging, an oily secretion, water control, and superior swimming; she was brought back for the aforementioned Alpha Flight run, but has had little resonance since that failed; given her appearance, she's a character an actor of any race could portray

Kara Killgrave (Earth-616) | Marvel Cinematic Universe2 Wiki | Fandom
Kara Killgrave (86; Mantlo) 80 (Uncanny X-Men July/19)
From Toronto and the daughter of Purple Man; as a character she's got no depth at all--she's young, has a romance with Manikin, and that's about it; her powers echo her father's, whereby she can control people's minds via pheromones; Mantlo made her a major focus in the comic, and while she remained afterwards she's never resonated--even in the wake of Jessica Jones' initial success on Netflix; I'd be surprised to see her appear in the MCU at all

Lillian Crawley (Earth-616) | Marvel Database | Fandom
Diamond Lil (83; Byrne) 76 (Magneto July/14)
From Yellowknife and a mutant; a brash, cocky, overconfident character (very Drax-like, for an MCU comparison), she wound up having a relationship (including marriage) with Madison Jeffries; Hudnall is the one who focused on her most and as an ancillary character I think she works; her power is superhuman durability; she's been unable to gain any resonance outside the IP and I don't expect to see her

Roger Bochs (Character) - Comic Vine
Box/Roger Bochs (83; Byrne) 56 (X-Men Annual Vol 2 Mar/07)
Canadian from an unknown location; disabled (having lost his legs and being wheelchair-bound); he was a late add to the team for Byrne, who seemed intent on investing more time with him, but Mantlo preferred Jeffries and he was gradually shifted away in his favour; he had a largely unrequited romance with Aurora (he also gets his legs back, which I thought was an odd decision); his abilities were via his suit, Box, which provided him the abilities described in Jeffries above; I like the character, but I think it's unlikely we see him (although his disability helps the odds a little)

Windshear | Yuna's Princess adventure Wikia | Fandom
Chinook/Windshear (90; Nicieza/Blair) 52 (Death of Wolverine Dec/14)
Also vaguely from Canada; he's barely a character, although he's meant to be a reformed villain of sorts (having worked for Roxxon); a mutant whose abilities were centered on manipulating air; after the end of the original Alpha Flight run he's hardly appeared anywhere; normally I'd say there's no chance we see him, but if the MCU wants a black Canadian character on the team, he's appeared the most from that demographic

Witchfire, whose real name is Ananym, is the daughter of the demon ...
Witchfire/Ananym (89; Hudnall/Calimee) 39 (Fear Itself May/12)
Presumed to be born in Limbo (the daughter of Belasco, a sorcerer), but her memories of her past are erased; despite her issue count she's only focused on once (when she snaps, via Furman), so she's barely a character, which I find bizarre because there's so much you could do with her background; she's magic-based, but not dependent on objects like those above; like Chinook she's barely appeared since the end of the original run and not in any of the Alpha Flight reboots (unlike the spellcasters above, she hasn't received the Doctor Strange association, instead cropping up in X-books until that stopped almost a decade ago)

Goblyn (87; Mantlo/Shoemaker) 38 (Deadpool Nov/14)
Born in the Liveworld dimension; she's barely a character who has no discernible arc (her sister and her family are essentially all the same block of content); a mutant whose powers include superhuman agility and enhanced healing; since the original AF-run she's appeared in exactly one flashback, but like Chinook she's a possibility if Marvel wants a black character on the team (they could, of course, simply race swap a more prominent character)

Prospective Lineup

While Sutton has provided what he's been told the lineup will be, I want to take a step back and think about what I think is probable. I've argued before that Marvel seems most comfortable introducing a small group of characters, but that conclusion was arrived at without fully doing the research. Let's look at the MCU's IP and see how groups are dealt with for heroes and their companions. There's a difference between using characters who have already appeared and those who have not, so that's the data to be looked at--new introductions are (when a different number) included behind a slash (characters listed in order of screen time, with a minimum of 5 minutes required).
Iron Man (2008)
Tony Stark/Pepper Potts/James Rhodes (3)
Incredible Hulk (2008)
Bruce Banner/Betty Ross (2)
Iron Man 2 (2010)
Tony/Rhodes/Pepper/Black Widow/Nick Fury (5/1)
Thor (2011)
Thor/Jane Foster/Erik Selvig/Darcy/Sif/Volstagg/Fandral/Hogun (8)
Captain America (2011)
Steve Rogers/Peggy Carter/Bucky (3)
The Avengers (2012)
Tony/Steve/Natasha/Bruce/Fury/Thor/Clint Barton/Phil Coulson/Maria Hill (9/1)
Iron Man 3 (2013)
Tony/Pepper/Rhodes/Harley Keener/Happy Hogan (5/1)
Thor 2 (2014)
Thor/Jane/Loki/Darcy/Selvig/Ian Boothby (6/1)
Captain America 2 (2014)
Steve/Natasha/Fury/Sam Wilson (4/1)
Guardians of the Galaxy (2014)
Peter Quill/Gamora/Rocket/Drax/Groot (5)
Avengers 2 (2015)
Tony/Steve/Bruce/Natasha/Clint/Thor/Wanda Maximoff/Pietro Maximoff/Vision (9/3)
Ant-Man (2015)
Scott Lang/Hank Pym/Hope van Dyne/Luis (4)
Captain America 3 (2016)
Steve/Tony/Bucky/Natasha/T'Challa/Wanda/Sam/Peter Parker/Vision/Rhodes/Scott/Sharon Carter (12/3)
Doctor Strange (2016)
Stephen Strange/Karl Mordo/The Ancient One/Christine Palmer/Wong (5)
Guardians of the Galaxy 2 (2017)
Quill/Gamora/Rocket/Drax/Yondu/Groot/Mantis/Nebula (8/1)
Spider-Man (2017)
Peter/Ned Leeds/Liz Toomes/Tony/Happy (5/3)
Thor 3 (2017)
Thor/Bruce/Valkyrie/Loki/Skurge (5/2)
Black Panther (2018)
T'Challa/Nakia/Shuri/Okoye/Everett Ross/Zuri/Ramonda/M'Baku (8/6)
Avengers 3
Gamora/Tony/Thor/Stephen/Quill/Vision/Bruce/Wanda/Peter/Rocket/Drax/Mantis/Natasha (13/0)
Ant-Man 2
Scott/Hope/Hank/Janet van Dyne/Bill Foster/Luis (6/2)
Captain Marvel
Carol Danvers/Fury/Maria Rambeau (3/2)
Avengers 4
Tony/Steve/Thor/Bruce/Clint/Natasha/Nebula/Scott/Rhodes/Rocket/Carol (11/0)
Spider-Man 2
Peter/Michelle Jones/Ned/Betty Brant/Fury-Talos/Happy Hogan (6/0)

This is a big list, so let's break it down. In an IP's first film four characters including the hero (excluding villains) are introduced that receive significant screen time (42/11 are the actual numbers); in sequels this is reduced to just one character (15/12). Only one of these films introduces an entire team (Guardians), but it largely echoes the other numbers. The Eternals has eleven characters on the docket (the most since the eight in Thor), but I believe screen time will boil down to similar numbers (focusing on Ikaris, Thena, Sersi, Black Knight, and perhaps one other)--what The Eternals is newly attempting is introducing a much larger cast (unlike Black Widow, which neatly fits the usual pattern).

What does all this mean? That my theory works for screen time, but doesn't exclude the possibility of a larger roster. Given that, who will appear? Let's quickly eliminate the eight characters introduced in the 1997 and 2004 failed reboots--they have no resonance. That aside, what about other side characters? Madison Jeffries has appeared the most and has an interesting power set, but despite that he's largely fallen off and he's a very bland; Wild Child seems more suited to duties specific to mutants and his core interaction with the team is as a villain; Purple Girl has nothing about her that screams Alpha Flight, suffers from being bland and needing her father introduced first; Diamond Lil has potential--the Drax-like personality--but I don't think that's enough to push her out of obscurity; as for Box, his disability could give him extra cache for the MCU, but he seems more like an Iron Man-character and the MCU might want to hold off on blocky armoured characters for something related to that (the team also already has a character in a suit, either Guardian or Vindicator). ChinookGoblyn, and Witchfire aren't really characters as such, although I think there's potential for the latter (it's just not specifically for the IP).

This brings us back to the early Byrne characters--the ones with resonance, even if how much outside the IP varies considerably (this belief and preference is made clear in the 2011 revival and 2019 one-shot, both of which eschewed the prior practice of shoving in new characters). I've highlighted those I feel certain about appearing in green and red for not appearing. Keep in mind the six members who appeared first in the comics (Guardian, Northstar, Aurora, Sasquatch, Shaman, and Snowbird), along with the animated iteration of this that added Puck (and Sutton echoes).
  • Guardian - Will appear--he's the founder of Alpha Flight, the first member to appear, and is deeply tied to Wolverine's origin--I don't think you can include the team without him being part of it; I don't think we'll see the Mantlo-version, but rather the Bryne-ian pseudo Captain America; in terms of actors you'd want someone in their mid-30s to early 40s in the role (if its one and done then the older side is fine)
  • Northstar - While Marvel has tentatively been trying to include LGBTQ characters for awhile, thus far these have been limp, awkwardly inserted token attempts; Northstar has been gay in the comics for decades, so his orientation is known and accepted; as for actors, mid to late 20s seems on point
  • Aurora - You can't have the brother without the sister, and fortunately Byrne made her interesting in her own right (the MCU can ignore her multiple personalities if they wish, but it's the most distinctive thing about her); her romance needn't follow the comics, but contrasting her two personalities means it's more evocative if she has one; her age range, naturally, would fit her brother's
  • Sasquatch - If we accept the premise that they appear in a Hulk vs Wolverine film, then a character like this is needed to battle the Hulk (although Snowbird could perform this function); I like the character development possibilities if he swaps genders, but I'd want that as part of a larger story, so he'd start out as per the comic; the character could be race-swapped (or even gender swapped); there's even the possibility they could merge this character with Snowbird; the actor is likely late 20s to mid 30s
  • Snowbird - I'm biased in enjoying how weird the character is and, even though I prefer her iconic look, I suspect Marvel would race-swap her given her origin (in theory to mixed-Inuk, unless they change who her mother is, which I consider unlikely); as a character she's thinly developed--not even Byrne spends much time going over how messed up her origin should make her--meaning she's likely not a focus for the group--if we get the Sasquatch swap, however, she's important to maintain; her combat abilities overlap with Sasquatch to some extent (so there is the possibility her character is merged with his); age range for her could vary quite a bit (from a teenager to late 20s)
  • Shaman/Talisman - I believe this is a case of one or the other and, given how stereotypical Shaman is on the surface, I feel like there's a strong possibility they go with his daughter instead (while she's less developed, there's more room for her to grow); if they use the father they would discard the name; we'll definitely see one of them; if it's the male character, then an actor in their 40s fits; if it's his daughter, than a teen to early 20s is on target
  • Puck - A fun character, but I'm not sure you need him for a Wolverine vs Hulk film; if/when the MCU uses him I'm also curious if they'll lean into his retconned (Mantlo) origin, or if they'll switch back to Byrne's original Batman-like idea--it depends on whether they'd want him to be a mystical character or not; I don't think he'd be a heavy focus regardless; as for actors, mid-to late 30s seems like the sweet spot
  • Vindicator - I don't believe she'll appear as a hero before her husband--her arc is much better with his tragic story intact; I think we'll see her as his wife without the suit, but very briefly in the film; the actress would be late 20s to early 30s (will Marvel keep her a redhead? It would be nice, but I'm dubious)
  • Marrina - She has the usual issues of water-based characters (what to do with them without water around); her character's struggle isn't a bad idea, but it's a bit limited and echoes Sasquatch's struggles with Tanaraq; the idea of attaching her to Namor rather than Alpha Flight seems like a better fit (even if the source for that idea isn't worthwhile)--she was with Alpha Flight briefly so removing her doesn't really impact the team (like Puck, she wasn't part of their iconic confrontation with the X-Men); an actress in her mid to late 20s fits (and, given her alien nature, she'd be open to any ethnicity)
Given the above, the core will be Guardian, Northstar, Aurora, and Shaman or Talisman. I would expect one or both of Sasquatch and Snowbird to be added (favouring the former, with a possibility that the two characters are merged). If it's a team of five then we definitively get Talisman instead of Shaman and Sasquatch over Snowbird (giving a gender balance of 3-2, with Sasquatch race-swapped for a similar split). It it's a team of six, adding Snowbird, this could mean one of Sasquatch or Snowbird remains comic accurate (probably the former), since I take it as a given that at least one will be swapped. If the team expands to seven or more characters, things open up considerably. I don't know how diverse Marvel feels the team needs to be--it's not about reflecting actual population (Canada is about as white as the US, but the minority split is very different), it's about marketing, which makes it hard to judge and it only really matters if they want the group to translate to a Disney+ show.

How many members on the team does Marvel want? Given that the prospective film already has two leads (Hulk and Wolverine), there's space to focus on just three Alpha Flight members with two or three supporting them. My guess is a team of five and that it will be Guardian, Northstar, Aurora, Sasquatch, and Talisman (the latter could be switched out for Snowbird, as she can take the female and, potentially, diversity slot, saving Talisman for later). This is what I think is most likely for this kind of film given the prior approach by the MCU. A show has a lot more room.

Beyond Wolverine - The Story for a Disney+ Show

To reiterate: I think what ultimately makes Marvel interested in the team is their association with Wolverine and the organic uniqueness of the team. With that said, Wolverine won't be around to anchor a show, so what will they do with them? There's a number of possibilities: they could lean into the modern association with Captain Marvel; keep them relatively independent ala the OG run of the comic; or go another direction. Let's look at the arcs from Bryne's run--and one other--for clues (since, as we're assuming the authenticity of Sutton's scoop, that seems like the most probable place for the MCU to draw from); to keep the citations simple, AF=Alpha Flight, with the number representing the issue, so AF1=Alpha Flight #1. Let's start with the prominent antagonists:
  • The Master of the World (AF 2-4, 13-16) - Both of his Byrne arcs were primarily development for Marrina and, at the end of both, she wound up leaving Alpha Flight (she doesn't really evolve as a character until Pak/Van Lente's short run); the Master is a pretty goofy villain and doesn't seem like a strong choice as the primary antagonist
  • The Great Beasts (AF 1, 6, 14-15, 23, 24) - The express enemies of Snowbird, but they are also attached to the stories of Shaman (who opposes them), Sasquatch (who has one inside him), and Talisman; while one-dimensional foes, they serve as character development and at minimum should appear for how impactful they are for that (including potentially Snowbird killing Sasquatch)
  • Omega Flight (AF 7, 11-12, 26-28) - Tied into Guardian's past, as well as that of the entire team since most of Omega Flight's members were part of Beta or Gamma Flight; their actions lead to the most iconic death in the run (perhaps the most iconic moment in the IP) and have significant impact on the characters and team afterwards--this is what I think the MCU will use as the main point of conflict for the show
  • Department H (AF volume 2 1-20) - The only non-Byrne inclusion (via Seagle); the idea of evil within the Department has potential, although it echoes Captain America: The Winter Soldier and likely Falcon and the Winter Soldier, so might be considered redundant or repetitive by Marvel
The screen time available over the course of a show allows for significant character development and there's a lot to work you can do with just with Byrne's material. Let's go through it:
  • Aurora - Her split personalities dislike each other, with the Aurora-persona actively trying to destroy (or block) her more conservative self (this is flipped much later to the other way around); she also has a romance with Sasquatch and a very combative relationship with her brother--all of this is good fodder for the MCU
  • Northstar - Loves his sister, but his efforts to help tend to make things worse; he was part of a terrorist organization before becoming a hero; his orientation offers material as well--I think the MCU would change the terrorist element to something more benign, but otherwise this is a good basis for character development
  • Shaman - Raises Snowbird, knew Vindicator as an adolescent, and has a damaged relationship with Talisman over the death of his wife--offering plenty to work with if the MCU thinks they can get around the stereotype (I don't think they'll try, ala The Ancient One in Doctor Strange)
  • Guardian - The key character dilemma is his complicated relationship with the government (given how briefly he's around, Byrne never invested in anything else)--this was massively complicated by later writers, but the original struggle is likely what the MCU would tap into
  • Sasquatch - His arcs are his relationship with Aurora, the inner conflict with the Great Beast, and potentially the Mantlo gender swap--all of this is good fodder for the MCU
  • Snowbird - Her bizarre parentage along with her singular mission offers opportunities; she also kills Sasquatch, which is pretty momentous--there's more Marvel could add to her, as the efforts to complicate her internal struggle within the comics were pretty weak
  • Vindicator - As a conciliator she's less dramatic internally, although if Guardian dies she'll struggle with PTSD afterwards (I don't think we'll see the self-doubting Mantlo version)
  • Marrina - Her issues are related to her origin as a Plodex and the risk of going berserk--Byrne never gave her any other internal conflicts and as her inner conflict echoes Sasquatch it could seem redundant to Marvel
  • Talisman - Her conflict with her father is her primary personal arc during her brief time under Byrne, so she would need further development
  • Puck - There's not much of an arc for him with Byrne--he desperately wants to be part of the team, which he becomes almost immediately; outside of being a confidant for Marrina and his romantic interest in Vindicator, not much personal happens for him--as a supporting character, however, he might not need anything else
To round this all out, assuming that Hulk vs Wolverine film happens and Alpha Flight is involved, I'd expect the film to touch on just a few bits of backgrounds (primarily Guardian, Sasquatch and Talisman or Shaman). The twins need the time available in a show to really delve into their issues. The Disney+ iteration would then follow Alpha Flight #1--the team being defunded and then going through the growing pains of forming anew (those rejected become bitter and opening the door for the Omega Flight plot). Early episodes would focus on the character elements mentioned above and conflict with one of the Great Beasts. The second half of the series (assuming six episodes) would be the Omega Flight story ending with Guardian's death and the decision by his wife to take over. That touches on most of the key elements from the early Byrne run and includes plenty of drama. The MCU could then gauge fan interest if they wanted to move beyond that and, if not, the characters are available for other IP. There would be ties to other things going on in the MCU, but since we have no idea what Marvel will be doing in 4-5 years, I can't really speculate on what those will be.

This article is written by Peter Levi (@eyeonthesens)